{"id":7071901,"date":"2026-10-14T18:30:53","date_gmt":"2026-10-14T18:30:53","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/accountants4yourbusiness.co.uk\/business\/real-estate\/date-before-you-marry-how-to-choose-the-right-tech-partner-for-your-brokerage-on-the-record-episode-3-ft-sj-yun\/"},"modified":"2026-10-14T18:30:53","modified_gmt":"2026-10-14T18:30:53","slug":"date-before-you-marry-how-to-choose-the-right-tech-partner-for-your-brokerage-on-the-record-episode-3-ft-sj-yun","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/accountants4yourbusiness.co.uk\/?p=7071901","title":{"rendered":"Date Before You Marry: How to Choose the Right Tech Partner for Your Brokerage | On the Record Episode 3 ft. SJ Yun"},"content":{"rendered":"<p> <br \/>\n<\/p>\n<div style=\" overflow: auto;\">\n<p class=\"wistia_preload_transcript_text\" aria-hidden=\"true\" tabindex=\"-1\" style=\"text-align: justify; font-size: 5px !important;\">Let\u2019s get engaged a little before we get married, right? For a long term commitment, because I want to make sure we\u2019re partnering up with somebody that really wants us to succeed, not just say, here\u2019s my tool, figure it out, enjoy, and here\u2019s my bill. Right? And if you choose to use AI, which I\u2019m not a huge fan of, always real estate agents are the best storytellers. Welcome to On the Record by MoxiWorks. I\u2019m your host technology columnist, Craig Rowe. And joining me today is SJ Yun, Chief Marketing Officer of Michael Saunders &amp; Company. SJ, thanks for joining me. What\u2019s been on your plate this week? What\u2019s been on my plate? What hasn\u2019t been? There are a lot of entities entering the industry that want to provide that kind of support, soft sales, mentoring, document help, that kind of thing through AI. I\u2019m sure you\u2019ve seen it, I\u2019m sure you\u2019ve been Yeah, pitching on do you guys stand on that? Do you think that\u2019s something the market wants to hear? That\u2019s a great question. I think there\u2019s a place where it needs to be properly, You need to look at it as a partnership with an AI platform or a solution, right? Yeah. Yes. You\u2019d like to try and cut down on the human element of back and forth and the time it takes to process something. But I think it still needs some sort of validation or checks and balance against what the output is. And the reason I say that, and I\u2019m just going to name drop totality, because that\u2019s where I read the report from. They said last year, consumer confidence in real estate related answers was 33%, not high, not low, but 33% this year it dropped to 16%. So what does that tell you? AI is not going anywhere. People are still going to ask you questions, but they are looking for somebody to validate that. And that\u2019s where our teams come in, Our real estate advisors or our marketing So you will have that partnership and that need to figure out, okay, if the output is to automate social pieces, right? For better or for worse, if you look at somebody\u2019s feed and you can tell how much of it was actually AI generated or not, and it\u2019s starting to look very similar to a bunch of others that are doing the same. So you really want a guy to say, okay, how can I help you distinguish between other agents that you are considering, whether you are a buyer and seller, what\u2019s the challenge that you\u2019re finding with most agent marketing today? And the number one thing on their list was everything looks and sounds the same. Yeah. So if you\u2019re all using the same tool for the same solution with no human input or genuine authentic reasoning into it, it\u2019s all going to deter and have the opposite reaction that you\u2019re hoping for. Yeah, I could see that. It\u2019s a good take. And these questions I\u2019m leading you a bit, but I wonder why we\u2019re not seeing more brokerages implement AI policy. And I\u2019ve just straight up here is what our brokerage feels are the best practices using AI. And maybe it\u2019s a little liberal, maybe they\u2019ll allow, hey, if you\u2019re going to use Claude or ChatGPT, these free models, please consider this. Or if you want to adopt a product that needs access to our systems, here\u2019s how that\u2019s going to work. And is this anything that you guys have talked about or are you hearing about in the It\u2019s something that we talk about internally every week. Actually have an AI committee I to talk about think in general, talking about AI governance is a requirement, right? It\u2019s not the sexiest thing to talk about when you\u2019re talking about AI. That\u2019s for sure. But there\u2019s a reason why when you\u2019re looking like when I\u2019m on LinkedIn, a good friend of mine at another brokerage said he went through AI implementation leadership course through one of those institutions. And when you look at the syllabus, there\u2019s actually two or three classes dedicated to just AI policy. That should tell you something and governance because that is true. Now, look, I\u2019m as reckless as anybody else can be. And I\u2019m in marketing, so I\u2019m going to try and make those lines as thin as possible so I can cross them. But, and yeah, but especially with the digital marketing background and seeing how things can break as you talk about security, you talk about all these things that happen that expose you and can cripple your business, not just the brokerage, but an agent\u2019s business, you have to take AI policy and governance very seriously. And you can\u2019t\u2026 I think you have to break it down into chunks, right? There\u2019s the AI best practices, which could fall under the policy of how to use it, what to do, what not to do. And then there\u2019s the more nitty gritty stuff where you talk about implementation and integration with other tools, right? Because then AI policy really needs to dictate what you allow it to see, how you store the data, how long it keeps the data, that stuff that maybe generally agents don\u2019t need to think about. But it is something that brokerages need to think about, especially at a leadership level, because when something goes wrong, it\u2019s always that small thing that happens that will usually lead to huge risk and exposure. So how you perform software due diligence, what leads you to a particular product and feel free to get into the kind of the granular aspects of it. Do you consult with some of the agents in the company? And I\u2019d love to hear kind of your take on that. So when it comes to that, I look at a few things and some of it is obviously reputation and references from other people that have used a platform or tool. But I really\u2026 For me personally, I wanna be able to make sure that they have a great support team, a person, not a chatbot that I can reach out to when there\u2019s an issue. And look, not every platform is a 100% perfect. I get that. That\u2019s the reality. And that\u2019s why tools evolve and get better each time. But when things break, when you\u2019re on the bleeding edge of technology and innovation, things are meant to break so that you know how to build it better. And that\u2019s where the support team comes, right? Sales teams are great at selling a vision. Support teams are the ones that have to deliver on that promise of that vision. And support teams don\u2019t get a lot of credit for it because they get the angry client all the time. Right? I look at that. I go out to agents and I solicit feedback and I ask them for advice and something that I\u2019ve been going back to a lot of vendors that I speak with now is can I get a pilot program in place? I don\u2019t want to sign. Let\u2019s get, let\u2019s date a little, let\u2019s get engaged a little before we get married. Right. For a long term commitment. Right. Like, let\u2019s see if this works and let\u2019s see what the agents, the people that are actually using it. Our agents, trainer, our managing brokers because they have to encourage it. Let\u2019s see what they say about it. Is this a useful tool to help you grow your business? Right. And is it effective? What\u2019s the return on investment? Will we see adoption? Those are the types of questions that we typically ask and make sure that we get the best. We get the best out of the tool, the best bang for our buck, essentially. And it goes back to your earlier comment when you were prefacing this question. I feel like part of this industry is we don\u2019t really have mentorship, even at the brokerage level. Would say we look to other brokerages as examples of look what the competition is doing. Could be a best practice because I see how successful it is. But when you look under the hood, see it\u2019s a mess and it\u2019s all wires going all over the place and it\u2019s not the clean operating cog or wheel that you thought it was originally. I think a lot of that we do to ourselves. I think especially the prop tech space is filled with snake oil salesmen, unfortunately, that take advantage of that lack of insight or perspective that brokerages need to be able to assess. So I try to go, I don\u2019t want to say aggressive, but a little bit more harder when we\u2019re considering partners. And I truly use that word partners than vendors, because I want to make sure we\u2019re partnering up with somebody that really wants us to succeed. Not just say, here\u2019s my tool. Here\u2019s my training guide. Figure it out. Enjoy. And here\u2019s my bill. Yeah, I\u2019m always really cynical about that, that the use of that phrasing from some companies we\u2019ve partnered with, they\u2019re paying you for it. You\u2019ve provided, you\u2019re providing. But if you but I think that comes down to the brokerage. Like you said, you have to be the one that holds them accountable for their promises made during the sales process, right? I do believe there are. Plenty of instances where it is a true partnership where, you know, your account person, if they\u2019re out, you know who you can call, you can just reach them via text or for a quick solution. Those, I think, are true partnerships and the right prop tech company that is going to celebrate in your success. You just don\u2019t disappear after the contract is signed. Right. I think that\u2019s the ones that do stand out. Yes. Yeah. And then also. Yeah, go ahead. Oh yeah, it is. And I think what I was going say is a lot of that comes down to adoption, right? So I\u2019d love to know what you do to encourage that. I\u2019ve seen all kinds of models and talked to all kinds of brokers who have different approaches to it. And man, it\u2019s hard. It\u2019s hard. And I don\u2019t know, I\u2019m really interested in learning from what you\u2019ve done to encourage adoption of products. I think there\u2019s a few things. It depends on the tool. I won\u2019t say we have a 100% adoption everywhere. I\u2019d be lying. One does But I will say when I look at adoption, I want to take a look at who is exactly adopting it. Right. Cause if they are the users and typically are, and not unsurprisingly our biggest users are our top producers. Right. They want to grow their business. They\u2019re, they are serious. They say, what do I need to learn to elevate my business and make more money? So they will take the time. So how do we get them excited about it? We build a communication plan to get them excited and understand the value of it, whether it\u2019s a tool that\u2019s just operational back office or something that\u2019s front facing advertising or social media posts or print something like that. We want to make sure that they understand exactly what we are offering to them. Why? So that it\u2019s not just, oh, look at our pretty tech stack. We have all these shiny pennies and we\u2019re paying a lot of money for very low adoption. And at the end of the day, it\u2019s why are we spending that much money if we could put it towards more of what things that are actually moving the needle. Yeah, for sure. Do you find like some of these top producers, are they a lot of them resistant? They hate say, look, I got here using this system or a lot of them open to change or adopting something new? I think they are open to it. I think typically, especially with top producers, they know if you\u2019re not learning, you\u2019re not earning. Right. So when, and they all are doing some form of what you are offering. So I\u2019ll give you an example. Right. There, was a top producer that I knew they worked out of their Rolodex. I\u2019m talking legit Rolodex and people who are not on of the age, essentially index cards on a little rolling thing that had names and contacts on there before cell phones. That\u2019s where I know some agents who are top producing agents that work their contact straight out of that. And we ask them, you have to constantly be curious with what your top producers are doing. We ask them, what do you do? And something that I found consistent across all our top producing agents is they go over their database. So even if it\u2019s not a CRM or it\u2019s not on their phone, this guy on the Rolodex would go through and update his Rolodex on a quarterly basis. He didn\u2019t just leave it there. He didn\u2019t let it sit. Right. That\u2019s not that different from putting it in a tool like MoxiWorks, for example, you could transfer that in there and do the same thing. So it\u2019s the same concept. It\u2019s just easier and you\u2019re applying the same end goal. So you have to sell that vision, right? It\u2019s the same thing. You\u2019re just doing it using a different method of how to do it. And some adopt to it, some don\u2019t, some are willing to try. Change management is painful, especially just even going back to AI policy. Change management is painful and usually it comes with a lot of enforcement. Right. And when you\u2019re met with resistance, either decide, okay, let\u2019s push through it and meet an end goal, or I\u2019m just going to revert back to what I know and keep at it until I cap out and I\u2019m done. And then I\u2019m just going to say no to every tool that I see. So that\u2019s, yeah, that\u2019s where I\u2019m at with that question. Yeah. Okay. I want to talk to you a little bit. I want to get a little granular for a second on change management. Yeah. You were with MoxiWorks for quite a while. Guys pivoted for a bit to an industry competitor, came back to MoxiWorks. Was that, did you have to manage that? Was a little more kid gloves coming into some of your agents and being like, Hey, all right, look, we\u2019re gonna, we\u2019re gonna shift back again. Like, think so. I think it went a lot smoother than we were anticipating it to be. And I think a lot of it came through communication. We let everybody know way ahead of time what we were doing. We wanted to train and make sure, okay, we\u2019re taking something away. We\u2019re bringing something back to the forefront for you. This is the value and this is how we can get you up to speed with what you need. But the third piece is we did a study. Okay. Again, not everything\u2019s perfect, but you did love something on this other platform. Were the things that you loved? What do we need to find solutions for to make you feel like even though we\u2019re giving you something, you\u2019re not losing the things that you loved about it? And I think we found a lot of great solutions out of that study and just learning more about what our agents truly need versus what they say they want. And you really have to distinguish between that. Yeah, I think too that there\u2019s probably a good, a healthy byproduct of you going through that process. Is that so often if in your traditional brokerage, if there\u2019s a group of agents or a team or even one, I guess struggling with the technology product, they start to get distracted and think the grass is out there. And I think in this case you guys went out and maybe you said, I guess it wasn\u2019t. We came back to what we know is going to work, what we know is going to give value to us and you may have eliminated that distraction. Right? So I\u2019m speculating here, but I would imagine maybe the adoption rate is even better on this rebound, right? On this coming back. I think so. Think we were a little more aggressive on the education side and I say aggressive in a good way, right? I wanted to make sure that it was at ad nauseam that people understood what you get out of this tool, whether you decide to use it or not, at least, you know, what your step, what you\u2019re stepping away from if you choose not to use it or what to look for if you\u2019re looking for something else. But I think that\u2019s at the agent service. And I think at a brokerage side, we really built out a thought process and a metric or a rubric for, okay, this is how we need to assess any partner that we want to partner up with. So when we go talk to partners, how receptive are you to feedback and change and how big are you to implement it? Or are you more, this is what it is. This is what you get. And then that\u2019s more of a platform and a vendor that you\u2019re talking to. When I talk about partners like MoxiWorks, I\u2019ll always give feedback and they say, okay, we\u2019re going to try this. It may not work, but this is what we think is the best solution for example. And, you know, and we\u2019re very happy with that. And that\u2019s the relationship that I\u2019m looking for when we\u2019re assessing partners, who can we talk to and communicate with truly that will hear us, right? Because yes, I\u2019m not a licensed agent, but I hear from our agents all the time and we want to make sure we give them the best. So if they are telling me that something\u2019s not working, I take it very seriously as a responsibility to work with our partners to make sure that they find a solution for it, because that\u2019s the big thing on every PropTech site. We offer a solution. And when I hear, start hearing things like workarounds that are not true solutions, I get a little deaf in the ear and I start seeing red flags. Yeah. Funny you mentioned that. I did a lot of work with a brokerage on some product consulting and we ran into some of those issues with a vendor that was offering workarounds, not a direct solution. And to me, a workaround means you\u2019re not solving anything. We can find a workaround. Yeah, that\u2019s why we\u2019re coming to you, right? Yeah. Did you have any was there? Did you have to upsell coming back to MoxiWorks? I think you have to, yes. I think we, you have to do a whole study, right? You have to, and I think it\u2019s not about trust. I think it\u2019s about demonstrating value, right? And articulating it. I think they\u2019ll trust that you\u2019ll do your due diligence to come to the right conclusion, but you need to demonstrate that you\u2019ve done your due diligence. And I think if you can make a strong case and they ask questions, you should be expecting a lot of hard questions about did you think about this? Did you think about that? What are we taking away? What can we provide them in return? What is the X factor with cost that comes into play? Really, all comes down to service and money. So how are we comparing the information and the value of decisions that need to be made if we decide to move out? What does the communication plan look like if we decide to move forward with it? So we try to go through a whole journey and it may seem like brain damage to some, but I think it\u2019s necessary brain damage to have those conversations ahead of time before you flip a switch as quickly as signing a contract, right? You don\u2019t want to go through that. I\u2019d rather go through it now than later, unfortunately. Yeah. One thing I talked to if a broker asked me about a software product and industry events and stuff, I get that a lot. And one thing I quickly advise them on is what is the status of the vendors you\u2019re considering? There\u2019s been a lot of consolidation in PropTech over the years, right? There\u2019s not a ton of big enterprise players And a lot of that\u2019s because they\u2019re taking on other companies. And I often ask us make sure that the company itself, vendor has their own ducks in a row internally. They\u2019re going through a number of acquisitions and there\u2019s all kinds of products they\u2019re trying to integrate. Like behind the curtain. It could be a real mess and it doesn\u2019t take much for that to bleed onto the stage. And suddenly the customers are seeing the ill gotten, seeing that it\u2019s not benefiting them when it\u2019s a big mess behind the scenes, they just can\u2019t get the attention and support that they need. Is that something you\u2019ve looked at over the years as well? Like, what\u2019s the status of these And software again, this is a relationship business. So, you know, lot of vendors, meet a lot of owners, prop tech owners, I think depending on how close your relationship is and when they\u2019re pitching you something, I do ask them transparently, are you building this to sell? Are you building\u2026 What\u2019s your long term plan here? Because I got to think about support. And yes, there\u2019s short term solution and long term solutions and things are always in a state of growth, but I have my immediate business needs, what I need to solve. But I do ask them if you\u2019re looking to sell, that\u2019s not a deal breaker for me. Right? Do understand the economics work. Right? Yeah. They have a business to run. They have a business to run, but is the value of the platform that you\u2019re offering there? Are you, is there a roadmap in place? What is on that roadmap? How are you adding to this roadmap? Is it coming from feedback from clients? Where do your developers at? I try to look at all those little things. It doesn\u2019t always add up to the final decision. Have they done layoffs? How they\u2019ve done consolidations? But I do, depending on my level of relationship with them, do ask them flat out, are you looking to sell? And that usually leads us down a conversation of what the long term goal is and how much they are ultimately invested in developing their product. Right. Because it\u2019s very telling, because just going back to my earlier point, I\u2019m looking for partners. So if you\u2019re looking to sell, that\u2019s fine. But if you\u2019re not looking for feedback as you\u2019re looking to sell and making changes to your product to make it a better sell for your next acquisition, then obviously you\u2019re looking for a quick payday and I\u2019m, you know, I\u2019d like everybody getting paid, but that\u2019s yes. This is why I like doing these interviews. That is great advice. Dig into that vendor, right? What are they really thinking down the road? And relative to the roadmap, I want to know if you have tons of like a lot of times they\u2019ll have these lengthy roadmaps with lot of big product upgrades or big changes. But that makes me think is like how much of your support in engineering is going to be dedicated to all these changes, all these product updates. And also who else are you listening to? What\u2019s driving all this change? Is there a real reason for it? Have you talked to your customers about all that change? Because that can be distracting for the customers, right? Especially if you\u2019re onboarding, right? If you\u2019re going through the process initially learning the product, it can be a real challenge. And when I\u2019m with whether I\u2019m actively engaged in talks with a vendor or I\u2019m actually engaged with a vendor or partner like MoxiWorks, for example, I will always ask if you\u2019re rolling out a new platform like rise, for example, what does the beta test look like? Can I get early access to it? Who doesn\u2019t want to play with something ahead of time? Right. Because the earlier I can get in on it, the quicker I can provide feedback. Right. And if, know, the support team is there to advocate for the changes that we\u2019re looking for, I\u2019d rather be at the front end of it than the latter end. Now if somebody\u2019s launching a fresh new product and it\u2019s untested and they\u2019re not open to any change, any feedback, guess what? I don\u2019t want to be a guinea pig. I think I learned that many times over. Yeah, no doubt. Let\u2019s get in a little bit to more of some traditional business concepts here. I want to know what\u2019s working for agents and brokerages on the marketing front these days. Like I know social is the easy just default for agents because it\u2019s cheap and it\u2019s easy to do. But I\u2019d like to know like how your fact, what strategies you\u2019re taking in. Are you looking at consumer metrics and behavior? Are you getting really granular with it? Yeah. Let\u2019s talk a little bit about that. What\u2019s working. I\u2019ll start off with what I\u2019m looking at and then I\u2019ll tell you what\u2019s working. Okay. I try to look at everything and I\u2019m not being facetious, but I look at website analytics, for example, I look at heat mapping. What are they clicking on? How much time are they spending on the website? Are we comparing it against last year\u2019s data? We launched a new website this year, comparing it against last year\u2019s data. How does that come into play with the traffic that we\u2019re seeing? What are the sources of it? Who\u2019s spending money? Things like that. So when we look at that data and then we start talking out into the field with our agents, I start asking, I essentially survey everybody, right? Because you need a continuous feedback loop. I find that\u2019s part of the strategy that is necessary because yeah, it\u2019s data and I like to be data informed, always data driven, right? Because there\u2019s a little bit of gut that is involved with decision making, but I don\u2019t want to do it blindly, right? I want to look at the data and make the best judgment based on what I\u2019m hearing from the field. And when I hear from the field, agents are telling me, okay, we need more of this, we need more of that. More doesn\u2019t always necessarily mean more quantity, It could also translate to quality. It\u2019s important to make the distinction in how I can solve for it. So what\u2019s working? Would say when I look at data overall, I try to put my finger on the pulse. You heard me cite all these other studies of what\u2019s going on. I try to package it up. I don\u2019t keep it to myself. Don\u2019t, my job is to make sure our agents are armed with that information. So going back to communication, education, keeping the lines open so that they know what is happening in market and what\u2019s available to them, how they can leverage it for their marketing, think is probably the strongest tool. I\u2019ll sum it up in one word essentially. It\u2019s storytelling that is the strategy. Storytelling in their social media, for example. And if you choose to use AI, which I\u2019m not a huge fan of always, but if you trip, what is the storytelling you want to do, whether it\u2019s with the listing, your brand, the neighborhood that you\u2019re working, people are looking for a hook to stay engaged, right? Meta didn\u2019t pay $17,000,000,000 for social addiction if it wasn\u2019t a real thing, right? Like, yeah, when you look at that and you\u2019re like, wow, people do get hooked on content. So if they\u2019re not really resonating with the content that I\u2019m sending out there, then something\u2019s missing. Like, I\u2019m not thinking about what my story is. Right. And it comes down to fundamentally what is the values that you want to show. Right. And usually I walk in and when I speak with agents and they say, how can I either I\u2019m new to business or I\u2019m trying to get back into the business or anything like that? I say, write down all the reasons why somebody should work with you, whether they\u2019re a buyer or seller, right? Just write it down. And then look at your social, look at your Google footprint. Look at what ChatGPT is saying about you. Do any of it does that jive with what you\u2019re seeing? Right. And if it\u2019s not, what is the storytelling that you need to do? Use that as your reference point. That\u2019s a great way to put it. Yeah. Tell that story. Tell it in a series of posts, right? Whatever it may be. And you know what I noticed my thousand years in this business, but what I noticed is the best real estate agents are the best storytellers. Yeah. I think storytelling is consistently the strategy that I\u2019ve seen work in its many permutations and iterations, right? Whether it\u2019s in their print, how they\u2019re telling their story, whether it\u2019s in social. And I don\u2019t mean like, oh, okay, this is my listing. This is my soul history. True. Okay. This is the challenge we faced and this is how we overcame it. And this is how we navigated it. The story is you be, be yourself. And people that bake that into the story. So fundamentally, even with storytelling, this is again, I hate to sound like a broken record, but this is a relationship business, right? And if you\u2019re looking for to build a relationship with a client, you need social proof and in social proof with that relationship, stories are the best way to build that relationship. Yeah. Yeah. So however you want to tell that story, whether it\u2019s through video, a series of posts, maybe it\u2019s a blog in your site, but you got to get that in front of the consumer, which is not easy, right? That\u2019s it\u2019s not easy. Fighting for attention is rough. I encourage anybody to just start somewhere. Right. I think if you let perfection get in the way of good or then you\u2019ll never start. Right. So like Mona Lisa, I believe isn\u2019t even a completed work of art, but look how many people come to visit. Right. I think part of marketing too, is sometimes you have to spend money to figure out what doesn\u2019t work. Sure. And I think, yeah, I think you have to also come to the realization that if you are running your own business as an agent, that yes, automation sounds great. Using AI sounds great. Getting things faster is great. But if you are trusting a tool to do everything for you, I think you have a challenge with really differentiating yourself and building value and people will see right through it, unfortunately. People come and say, sometimes sit with us and they\u2019re like, I\u2019m just looking for a platform that will automate all my social posting for me. It will automatically create all the content, not just listing content. I want it to tell neighborhood. Okay. But where\u2019s your voice in it? And I think you have to look at it as a scale or a pendulum. Right? And even going using AI governance as an example, the more you want to use AI and it swings one way. Right? It\u2019s even more important on the other side of that pendulum to focus on governance and enforcement. The more you focus on marketing automation, the more time you have and value. It\u2019s even more important to focus on how do I make sure that I\u2019m an individual and getting that point across with my marketing and storytelling that this, that when I\u2019m doing an e blast, that this still feels special and authentic. And if, if that time is not being spent in that level of thought, and you\u2019re just auto hitting a button and expecting everything to be done, you already lost that you need to reset and talk to your partners or talk to your agents and really think about what your strategy is. Ashjay, that was a great way to wrap it all the way back around to AI policy and all that sort of thing. This has been great. I want to thank you very much for your time for joining MoxiWorks with On The Record. And please if there\u2019s any way people would want to get ahold of you or ask you questions or kind of glean that knowledge without revealing too much, how can people get ahold of you? Can hit me up on LinkedIn or they can email me at sjyunmichaelsaunders.com So you can find me and my footprint is available and large and wide there. Great. Thanks so much for again, for joining us. And again, I\u2019m Craig Rowe, and this has been On the Record with MoxiWorks. Thank you.<\/p>\n<\/div>\n\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Let\u2019s get engaged a little before we get married, right? For a long term commitment, because I want to make sure we\u2019re partnering up with somebody that really wants us to succeed, not just say, here\u2019s my tool, figure it out, enjoy, and here\u2019s my bill. Right? 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